Home

T Bone's Games Diner

Toys for GURPS and other Role Playing Games
Home DECIDE: Drop Excess Combat Info from Defense Evaluation
  • Home
  • Content Stuff
  • Communication
  • Diner Stuff

Thanks for taking the time to post a new comment or a reply to one! First scan these quick notes, if you please:

General

* Currently, previewing a post is optional; you're welcome to preview or post immediately.

* You should see plain text input by default; click "enable rich text" for fancy formatting tools. (Some people love that and some don't. Be aware that formatting tool performance may vary by browser.)

* With apologies to all, I have to use a simple "captcha" question for unregistered posters. Otherwise, the spam flow will dwarf the Nile.

Registration and login

* Registration is available! Sign up here. Chief benefits at present include the ability to edit your own comments and manage subscriptions (newsletter, threads, etc.).

* If you'd prefer to post as an unregistered visitor, that's welcome too. Just leave "Your name" as the default "Esteemed Visitor", or type in some other name. (But if you happen to type in a name used by a registered user – say, "tbone" – you'll get an error telling you so when you hit "post comment". And while your post text should still be there, waiting for a revised user name, there's a chance it could disappear.)

* If you're a registered user but haven't logged in and want to post a quick comment as Esteemed Visitor, that's fine; see above.

* If you're a registered user but haven't logged in, and enter your user name under "Your name" when posting, you'll get an error saying that's the name of a registered user. That's a good thing; it means strangers can't make posts under your user name! But as above, there's a chance of losing your post text. It's best to log in first here, and then start your posting.

Final

All the above is standard stuff for community web sites, but reminders are good; I hate post-related glitches, and hate to see people run into them on this site. On this or any site, it's a good practice to do a quick "Select All" and "Copy" on your post text before hitting "Preview comment" or "Post comment" – just in case.

For more on the whole topic of interaction with the site, please see User Interaction (opens in new window).  

Brought to you by:

Welcome, new visitors!

Is this your first visit? Consider subscribing to this site's RSS feed to get updates, or to the newsletter for the occasional mailbox surprise.

(Were you, by chance, searching for "diner games"?)

This site is full of original material for players of table-top role-playing games. Input and collaboration is welcomed! Please read more about the site here. Or just dive in to whatever looks interesting.

A couple of recommendations: GURPS players, check out what's at The GURPS Diner. The house special is GULLIVER, an easy rules expansion for creating and playing odd-sized creatures. To see the lunch, dinner, wine, and kids' menus all at once, peek at the site map. Take your time; the busboy will be along shortly to clear you a place.

Internet Explorer Users:

This site – like wide swaths of the Web – may not display properly with Internet Explorer 6.0 or lower. For your own sake, please upgrade to 7.0 or higher! Or even better, to fully enjoy the Web, try Safari or Firefox.

Tomes of Power

  • Gurps Bio-tech (Gurps)
    Gurps Bio-tech (Gurps) cover image
  • GURPS Magic
    GURPS Magic cover image
more

Subscribe Buttons

Feed Icon
XML Icon
Google
Delicious
Yahoo!
Bloglines
Newsgator
Feedster
AOL
Furl
Rojo
Newsburst
Pluck
FeedFeeds
Simplify

Wandering content

  • Recycled content: gaming Giants in combat

Roll vs Search


On this site:

  • Home
  • Content Stuff
    • blog
    • rules articles
    • rules nuggets
    • The GURPS Diner
  • Communication
    • user interaction
    • forums
    • polls
    • newsletter
  • Diner Stuff
    • about
    • FAQ
    • links
    • bookshelf
    • support
    • contact
    • site map

Patron advantage

Revised Defense Flow: REVISE THE WHOLE THING?

Submitted by tbone on Wed, 2007-07-18 15:31.

Thanks, everyone, for the many comments. With great points made by people here and on the SJG forums, I need to make some revisions to the article, such as adding some points about Feints, critical hits, etc.

But wait...

There's a bigger revision to be made. After all the discussion, I now think the entire focus of my article is a bit off target.

I began with, and focused on, this question:

"Should the defender make the decision to defend before or after the attacker checks TH?"

But that's not actually the core issue. The real question to ask is this:

"Should the defender know the TH result when he decides to defend?"

What's the difference?

If you play with all rolls made openly, it's the same thing. The only way the defender won't know the TH result before he decides to defend, is if you don't roll TH before he decides to defend. So either way, we end up talking about order: deciding defense first, and then rolling TH.

But you could play with hidden TH rolls as well – especially the GM's TH rolls for NPC attackers. In that case, when the TH roll is made doesn't matter. What matters is whether or not the defender knows the result before defending.

Or as I mused in the forum, it all boils down to:

Do we say to the defender, "The attack will hit; what do you do?" Or do we say, "The attack might hit; what do you do?"

That one-word difference – "will" vs "might" – is the heart of it all.

So. The way I've been playing the revision, and all the points in the article, are valid. But in writing about it, I focused on order of steps: how to order statements of defense, rolls, etc. That's all peripheral. It's really not an issue of order and flow, but an issue of character knowledge.

It's this one question:

"Should the defender know the TH result when he decides to defend?"

You all know my response: "Maybe he should know versus melee attacks; it's debatable and can be played several ways. But versus gunfire, no, the defender should have to act without knowing the TH results." No change in my take on things.

But would you agree that it's better to recast the whole issue in terms of the above question about character knowledge, rather than focusing on order of things?

Break time

And that's enough from me for the moment; time for a break. One interesting thing about the topic is that it's simultaneously deep and important to the game, yet profoundly trivial at the same time!

Reply

Please solve the math problem above and type in the result. e.g. for 1+1, type 2. Sorry, I have to cast Detect Spammer...
The content of this field is kept private and will not be shown publicly.
  • You may quote other posts using [quote] tags.
  • Lines and paragraphs break automatically.
  • Web page addresses and e-mail addresses turn into links automatically.
  • Use <!--pagebreak--> to create page breaks.

More information about formatting options

Powered by WebRing.

Copyright 2007 by T Bone. The GURPS Diner is born of OS X and Drupal.

RoopleTheme